tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post7434178694731404842..comments2024-03-18T11:38:13.384-02:30Comments on Elfshot: Maybe the Maritime Archaic Hafted Stemmed Points like this...Timhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11473674521424237610noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post-44179618944477235232010-12-17T16:25:26.798-03:302010-12-17T16:25:26.798-03:30I don't know, in the Maritime Archaic stemmed ...I don't know, in the Maritime Archaic stemmed points where there is a marked change in the angle, the bend seems to come at a point more or less the same distance up from the base. If the entire blade was exposed, and the change in the angle came from doing the minimum amount of retouch possible, then it seems like there should be more variability in where along the edge the bend happens. Some should bend very close to the tip and some closer to the base, but in fact, it seems like when they bend its about an inch up from the shoulder.<br /><br />It isn't that difficult to resharpen a small section of a point without creating a noticeable bend in the angle if there isn't something phsyically blocking your access to the edge.<br /><br />Stems and notches were something that people started experimenting with in the archaic period, prior to that all points would have had lashing that covered the lower edges of the point.<br /><br />Luckily, I think the evidence, one way or the other, should be visible on the actual artifacts.Timhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11473674521424237610noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post-65071822097058661022010-12-17T16:09:58.650-03:302010-12-17T16:09:58.650-03:30If I have to resharpen something I will resharpen ...If I have to resharpen something I will resharpen the whole thing, whatever I can get at, not just the tip. I am not going to sharpen the tip and say 'nah, thats good enough'.<br />If this were a the result of expediency then we would see it in a lot more cases and throughout various times and cultures.<br />The shoulder thing, yeah the wad of sinew wrapped around the shoulder of the point would be a detriment to the point's "penetrating / cutting" efficiency. But I would be willing to take that inefficiency over the loss of time resulting in having to rehaft the whole thing. Oh, but wait a second, in your argument you are creating the inefficiency needlessly because you were to lazy (sorry I meant expedient) to straighten out the edge.<br />The more I think about this the more I disagree with you, you're not going to leave lumps/shoulders in a blade for expediency unless you have to. <br /><br />:OPUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14363108273569776527noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post-40390603131781840232010-12-17T15:45:35.889-03:302010-12-17T15:45:35.889-03:30Steve -
"...why would you stop at the mid poi...Steve -<br />"...why would you stop at the mid point of the blade?"<br /><br />My answer: Pure expediency. You fix only what is broken.<br /><br />"...By stopping you are creating shoulders in the cutting area, basically making the job of penetrating/cutting the animal that much more difficult".<br /><br />Do you really think that a slight shoulder along the lateral edge of a projectile point would make much a difference? <br /><br />Don't you think that the wad of sinew wrapped around the shoulder of the point would be more of a detriment to the point's "penetrating / cutting" efficiency? <br /><br />I'd argue that in either case, the point would still be functional - and as such is not evidence in support of Tim's original suggestion.John Erwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11557136521355806134noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post-34818564147005154202010-12-17T15:34:52.493-03:302010-12-17T15:34:52.493-03:30(Yes, I am commenting again!)
OK, I read the post ...(Yes, I am commenting again!)<br />OK, I read the post and thought I agree with Tim. Then John explained his concerns with the idea and I thought 'well that makes sense too'. But now I've had time to consider what John said and I think I disagree again.<br />John I see your point but let me ask you this, if you were resharpening/shaping a point why would you stop at the mid point of the blade? unless you had too as per Tim's idea - hafting material was in the way)<br />By stopping you are creating shoulders in the cutting area, basically making the job of penetrating/cutting the animal that much more difficult.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14363108273569776527noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post-62018798871285369722010-12-17T13:09:25.871-03:302010-12-17T13:09:25.871-03:30Yeah, you're right on all counts - they need a...Yeah, you're right on all counts - they need a more detailed examination than is possible from photographs. I'll definitely be looking for grinding and differences in flaking patterns around that bend the next time I visit the collections. <br /><br />But before seeing photos of these points it hadn't occured to me to even bother looking at that part of the edge.Timhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11473674521424237610noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5086026991280831425.post-90900110055601925932010-12-17T12:45:23.274-03:302010-12-17T12:45:23.274-03:30The re-shaping of the distal portions of these poi...The re-shaping of the distal portions of these points certainly could have been restricted by hafting technique, but it may also be simply a matter of expediency. If a tip was damaged and was to be repaired - you might only re-shape the damaged portion. <br /><br />In the case of the two possibilities, I don't think that there is sufficient evidence to choose one over the other. <br /><br />In the case of the higher hafting argument, I would be more inclined to agree with you if you had evidence of grinding along the lateral portions around which lashings were fixed.John Erwinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11557136521355806134noreply@blogger.com